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Topic: Just out of curiosity.... (Read 305 times)
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slightcrazed
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Just out of curiosity....
« on: August 31, 2005, 04:45:23 PM »
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... because I know that there are people from outside the US who read this forum - What has the sentiment been in your country regarding the damage caused by hurricane katrina? Are there any people pushing charities or suggesting help? Is there concern at all, or are people just going about their business?
I'm not trying to start a flame war, I am genuinely curious. This is a serious event that will affect many within the US and throughout the world. I know that it's getting play here in the states, but I don't know if those outside the US are aware of the magnitude of the situation. I read one post on another website where a someone said that the US is just getting what they deserved, but I have to believe that this was just a rambling lunitic who was looking to pick a (virtual) fight.
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Deuce
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Re:Just out of curiosity....
« Reply #1 on: August 31, 2005, 06:51:41 PM »
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on one side.. it is tragic on how so many people died.. and how the media's own agenda is getting in the way of actually giving news updates (they seem to like to mention how president bush was on vacation when all this happened, but neglect to mention that MOST of washington is on vacation..)
but on the other side.. so many deaths are based on pure stupidity. there were so many days of advance notice to get the hell out of there.. so many warnings by the local government.. and so many people ignored it. not to mention all the looting that is happening down there.. makes me feel real proud of our southerners.
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Terraji
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Re:Just out of curiosity....
« Reply #2 on: August 31, 2005, 09:24:41 PM »
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Stuff happens, people are stupid. I agree with Deuce entirely, the media tends to ruin everything. Just because a few hundred americans die, it gets front page for weeks, and all the other shite that goes on in the world stops mattering.
I would reccomend that you throw a few dollars to a charity for the hurricane victims but while you are at it throw a few hundred dollars to the Tsunami victims that are still homeless and orphaned, a few hundred dollars to the AIDS crisis in Africa, and another few hundred to Cancer research.
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Deuce
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Re:Just out of curiosity....
« Reply #3 on: August 31, 2005, 09:29:08 PM »
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I will say one thing though.. we send so many people to help with the tsunami relief.. or to earthquake disasters in the middle east.. here's a list of the countries who are sending people to help assist the hurricane disaster:
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slightcrazed
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Re:Just out of curiosity....
« Reply #4 on: August 31, 2005, 09:45:37 PM »
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I really hope that that is not true Deuce, only I think it may very well be the case.
We get berated and condemned for not doing enough to help other countries, and ignored when in need ourselves. It would gladden me to hear that the world knows our pain and will help us as we have helped them countless times before.
...but I'm not holding my breath.
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Re:Just out of curiosity....
« Reply #5 on: August 31, 2005, 11:06:48 PM »
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I will say one thing though.. we send so many people to help with the tsunami relief.. or to earthquake disasters in the middle east.. here's a list of the countries who are sending people to help assist the hurricane disaster:
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I know Venezuela, Russia, and Canada have alread offered assistance. What constitutes assistance I don't remember.
I agree with Deuce if you're dumb or stubborn enough to try and ride out hurricanes, then you're rolling the dice. And anything south of the mason-dixon line I generally ignore.
Edit: I further agree with the assesment of the "news channels". If you think or expect them to be anything more than a bunch of partisian hacks than you're sadly mistaken. I never watch news channels but tonight my mom had CNN on (don't remember the guy). The had a segment about viewers writing in about the hurricane. They said they had recieved some 6000 responses. They showed four of them. The first one is someone with general concern for the people and wished them well, the second bashed bush, the third asked where the outer countries were (commentator made a french sucks joke) and the last letter blamed the hurricane on Iraq. Out of 6000 responses THAT'S WHAT YOU CHOSE TO AIR?!!?!? I don't care what you think about Bush, the French, or the Iraq war, but that's just a disgrace. GG tv.
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| « Last Edit: August 31, 2005, 11:16:26 PM by Surgeon General » |
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Re:Just out of curiosity....
« Reply #6 on: September 01, 2005, 04:16:14 AM »
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I heard about this from the advance warnings and the evacuation order which did make the news across here. However, it's nowhere near the scale of the boxing day tsunami.
I think some issues here are that:
A) The USA is the strongest and most powerful country in the world and there was clear prior warning for this event - therefore it wouldn't be too wrong to assume that the US have mobilised their own search/rescue/rebuild effort.
B) Bush's reputation for unilateral crusades and flat-footed bumbling of foreign policy, however unwarranted some of you might think it is, may make foreigners think that their help isn't wanted.
C) The Tsunami hit right in the middle of the Xmas/Holiday period when people are already very conscious of the plight of the worse-off so the Tsunami appeal may have been affected by that.
D) The big hitter right now is the MAKE POVERTY HISTORY campaign which is trying to eradicate 3rd world debt and make trade fair as well as trying to alleviate hunger and disease. Out of all the principal countries who are helping, the US gives the most in actual figures but the least in terms of percentage of their total means - and this is a stat which has been highly publicised - moreso than the Hurricane I would say. It puts the "we're always helping everyone else" comment in a bit of question. There's definitely a gap in what Americans think the US contribution to world aid is and what people from foreign countries think about it.
E) The media does indeed suck.
Personally, I can't imagine the devastation of a hurricane and my heart goes out to the families and friends of those who lost their lives.
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slightcrazed
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Re:Just out of curiosity....
« Reply #7 on: September 01, 2005, 07:22:50 AM »
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D) The big hitter right now is the MAKE POVERTY HISTORY campaign which is trying to eradicate 3rd world debt and make trade fair as well as trying to alleviate hunger and disease. Out of all the principal countries who are helping, the US gives the most in actual figures but the least in terms of percentage of their total means - and this is a stat which has been highly publicised - moreso than the Hurricane I would say. It puts the "we're always helping everyone else" comment in a bit of question. There's definitely a gap in what Americans think the US contribution to world aid is and what people from foreign countries think about it.
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You're kidding me, right? This is a joke. It has to be....
I don't know what to say.... I ask for compassion, I ask for some depth of feeling, some expression of pain and sympathy over the THOUSANDS DEAD and MILLIONS HOMELESS in the south, and what do I get? I get exactly what I expected... an international community that thinks WE (the US) should do MORE for others, and that because we're the US we're on our own. You hipocritical ass hole.
You know what Justboy, I wish I was vindictive enough to hope that your country suffered the same type of disaster, so that I could laugh at your need as you have mocked ours. I'm not, but I almost wish I was.
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Re:Just out of curiosity....
« Reply #8 on: September 01, 2005, 08:25:12 AM »
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I think you need to reread his post. Some major misinterpretation going on. He wasn't mocking America, nor was he showing no compassion. Calling him an asshole was completed uncalled for.
As to the original question, I didn't even know about the hurricane. I'd seen threads on forums entitled 'Katrina', but I had no idea what they were referring to.
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Re:Just out of curiosity....
« Reply #9 on: September 01, 2005, 08:27:38 AM »
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| I get exactly what I expected... an international community that thinks WE (the US) should do MORE for others, and that because we're the US we're on our own. You hipocritical *** ****. |
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Wow, I totally didn't read JB's post that way at all. 
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slightcrazed
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Re:Just out of curiosity....
« Reply #10 on: September 01, 2005, 08:36:43 AM »
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Then how am I supposed to take it?
What I got out of his post was that The international community (at least from his point of view) doesn't think that the Hurricane was a big enough event, and that because America doesn't give enough 'per capita' to the rest of the world that the world could care about our problems.
What did I miss? Please tell me how I am supposed to interpret his comments?
As for the name calling, my apologies. My emotions are getting the better of me right now. I didn't mean Justboy in particular (it was supposed to be holes, not hole). The comment was directed at anyone who believes that we should give to others but that we don't deserve help ourselves.
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| « Last Edit: September 01, 2005, 08:39:42 AM by slightcrazed » |
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Re:Just out of curiosity....
« Reply #11 on: September 01, 2005, 08:54:33 AM »
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I think the point was that some people outside America see it as a huge nation of vast resources and therefore one that is best equipped to react to disasters on home soil. In terms of it being a 'big enough event', I don't think it's a case of not caring, it's a case of not knowing the full story. Someone might walk past a news stand today and see a headline 'HURRICANE DEVASTATES NEW ORLEANS' and think 'That's a terrible shame' but nothing else - the reason for that is purely because, unless you know facts about this particular case, there's no reason to assume it's any different from previous hurricanes. News outlets will always use headlines like that, and the sad fact is that as a result people become jaded and don't react to them the way they should. I caught a glimpse of pictures on the news for a second or so and it didn't even occur to me that Katrina could be something entirely more disastrous.
Certainly people who 'believe that we should give to others but that we don't deserve help ourselves' are in a tiny, idiotic minority.
Now I just tried searching for somewhere to make a donation, but all I could find was the US Red Cross site, which obviously only takes credit cards. Anyone help me find a UK site that's taking contributions? If not I'll look for people collecting on the street when I'm in Aberdeen next week.
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Re:Just out of curiosity....
« Reply #12 on: September 01, 2005, 09:09:25 AM »
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Yeah, it's pretty bad. CLTV (ChicagoLand TV, which is local) is reporting right now on how they're moving people to the AstroDome or SuperDome or something all the way in Texas. They're using an entire football stadium as a shelter. The levvies in New Orleans are pretty messed up. They're saying the city won't be occupiable for at least 3 months.
yurei and I were talking about the looting yesterday too, and while it's unquestionably wrong to steal, these people are not carrying off TVs and stereos, they're taking food, water, diapers and first aid stuff. What's more, there's still half a meter of water in all of the news clips showing people coming out of stores with stuff in their hands-- a TV isn't going to do these people a darned bit of good. This is survival, not "theft for pleasure" so to speak. If there were effective relief efforts in place, you can bet the looting would be significantly lessened.
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| « Last Edit: September 01, 2005, 09:14:58 AM by Porter » |
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Justboy
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Re:Just out of curiosity....
« Reply #13 on: September 01, 2005, 09:28:15 AM »
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You've misunderstood my first comment in that post slight. I didn't mean to say that the event was small - I meant to say that the media portrayal and campaign was small compared to the coverage given to the tsunami.
I was carrying on the "media portrayal" discussion which seemed to be the way the thread was going. I wasn't saying the US don't deserve aid - that's ridiculous. I was asserting some issues and opinions which exist throughout Europe and the rest of the world. My entire post was talking about attitudes regarding the media and my perception of public opinion towards the US.
I wasn't mocking anyone and I don't really think I deserved that abuse.
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Deuce
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Re:Just out of curiosity....
« Reply #14 on: September 01, 2005, 10:49:09 AM »
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| You've misunderstood my first comment in that post slight. I didn't mean to say that the event was small - I meant to say that the media portrayal and campaign was small compared to the coverage given to the tsunami. |
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of course the media coverage would be smaller for the tsunami..it didn't happen to us. As the American media being one of the biggest forms of communication and information around the world, if something happens in America, of course it will be their main focus.
One thing ive accepted about the politics of the world is other countrie's harsh views towards the US.. mainly because even though they might hate us, i know deep down that they HAVE to rely on us. It's the negative of being the Big Brother country.. despite the fact that we are mocked by other countries.. you know that if any thing happened, we would be there in a second to help, and the ones that we aid would gladly accept the help.
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Re:Just out of curiosity....
« Reply #15 on: September 01, 2005, 10:51:25 AM »
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another thing that is most likely not as noticed in other countries about result of this hurricane:
a major US city was destroyed. not only did people die, but our economy took a nasty hit. New Orleans is a major producer of oil.. within a day, gas in Vermont went from $2.60 a gallon to $3.20
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Re:Just out of curiosity....
« Reply #16 on: September 01, 2005, 12:55:08 PM »
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My thoughts.
1) We shoud be contributing to disaster relief because we are concerned about the welfare of others not because we expect them to reciprocate.
2) Stupidity used to be a self-curing disease, but "civilized" countries like the U.S. have managed to defeat it. (I'm paraphrasing someone here but I can't remember who) I just don't understand why people living on a flood plain below sea level decided to stick around for what was damn near a category 5 hurricane. I know some people simply didn't have the means to get away, but many of those interviewed made a conscious choice to stay and try to ride it out. Hell Brett Favres family could've gone 50 miles inland to his place and been safe, instead they spent a night in their attic because the water got so high.
3) My heart goes out to those who've lost everything, the sad thing is we'll rebuild it all and then in another 50 years a storm will come thru and wipe everything out again.
4) Don't get me started on gas prices that's the biggest scam going. If the price of milk and water went up 30%+ overnight the entire populace would be up in arms with price gouging accusations.
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slightcrazed
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Re:Just out of curiosity....
« Reply #17 on: September 01, 2005, 02:21:33 PM »
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4) Don't get me started on gas prices that's the biggest scam going. If the price of milk and water went up 30%+ overnight the entire populace would be up in arms with price gouging accusations.
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I'm up in arms over the price gouging.... come on, who's with me?
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Re:Just out of curiosity....
« Reply #18 on: September 01, 2005, 03:18:52 PM »
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usually when a disaster happens canada sends The Red Cross, our radio stations are swamped with donation lacations and my police cheif sent a releif crew email to the red cross to offer help today if i or anyone else would like to go, this was the same for 9-11 because of the officers who died,the ones that lived worked double overtime so we were honoured to releive them, we havent heard if the policing is being stepped up around orleans but we will be there if they need us. As far as gas prices   
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Re:Just out of curiosity....
« Reply #19 on: September 01, 2005, 03:33:54 PM »
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another thing that is most likely not as noticed in other countries about result of this hurricane:
a major US city was destroyed. not only did people die, but our economy took a nasty hit. New Orleans is a major producer of oil.. within a day, gas in Vermont went from $2.60 a gallon to $3.20
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The entire gulf coast is home to many of our country's oil refineries and everytime a tropical storm comes within 200 miles, people get scared and gas prices rise. 
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Re:Just out of curiosity....
« Reply #20 on: September 01, 2005, 06:08:35 PM »
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1) We shoud be contributing to disaster relief because we are concerned about the welfare of others not because we expect them to reciprocate.
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That's why people should do anything, not because you expect anything in return. Any gestures of aid should be appreciated, regardless of whether they met your expectations or not.
Countries should offer aid to those affected because it's the right thing to do. Not offering it because they don't think we want it, don't need it, or because of Bush's "flat footed bumbling" in regards to foreing policy is in my opinion ridiculous.
Thankfully, I'm reading that countries are stepping up and offering help regardless of what they think of our policies. And that is all I ask.
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Re:Just out of curiosity....
« Reply #21 on: September 01, 2005, 06:53:07 PM »
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Now I just tried searching for somewhere to make a donation, but all I could find was the US Red Cross site, which obviously only takes credit cards. Anyone help me find a UK site that's taking contributions? If not I'll look for people collecting on the street when I'm in Aberdeen next week.
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try looking around here
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Re:Just out of curiosity....
« Reply #22 on: September 01, 2005, 09:12:54 PM »
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i drive by oil refineries on my way to work everyday, and still the gas prices are astronomical. ($1.15/litre compared to $0.85 two months ago)
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