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Topic: Some bad maps! (Read 844 times)
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rich-hobo
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Some bad maps!
« on: August 28, 2003, 12:31:27 AM »
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i was playin cs today, and the map changed to cs_backally, and it went from 8 v 7 to 4 v4, and the last people were tyring to vote it out in console, so just could we do a poll on some bad maps or somethin?
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Re:Some bad maps!
« Reply #1 on: August 28, 2003, 12:38:36 AM »
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http://www.csreloaded.com/yabbse/index.php?board=16;action=display;threadid=722
Read that whole thread before you reply please, especially Alkali's and my posts.
Backalley is my favorite map by the way, what's yours kidshaft? I really do want to know... I'm going somewhere with it.
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[Wumpa] Porter
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slightcrazed
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Re:Some bad maps!
« Reply #2 on: August 28, 2003, 07:45:47 AM »
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Backalley is a good map, but it does seem to empty the server faster than Bee Arthur stripping at an alcohol free bachelor party.
slight
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I once beat Drizzt Do'Urden at thumb wrestling.
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Grounded
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Re:Some bad maps!
« Reply #3 on: August 28, 2003, 08:09:48 AM »
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I like backalley 
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Deuce
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Re:Some bad maps!
« Reply #4 on: August 28, 2003, 08:13:40 AM »
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i like es_losangeles..but nooo..someone thinks the doors are too big..
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Grounded
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Re:Some bad maps!
« Reply #5 on: August 28, 2003, 10:48:35 AM »
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You really love that map don't you Deuce? 
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Deuce
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Re:Some bad maps!
« Reply #6 on: August 28, 2003, 10:49:48 AM »
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its the best es map in my opinion
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Re:Some bad maps!
« Reply #7 on: August 28, 2003, 11:06:38 AM »
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...which unfortunately says something about the quality of the rest of the es_ maps too. 
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[Wumpa] Porter
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Deuce
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Re:Some bad maps!
« Reply #8 on: August 28, 2003, 11:13:22 AM »
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es_losangeles = 
cs_backalley = 
so there
EdIT- i wonder if these little icons will appear on other computers.. 
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| « Last Edit: August 28, 2003, 11:14:39 AM by Deuce » |
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Primer
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Re:Some bad maps!
« Reply #9 on: August 28, 2003, 04:44:57 PM »
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Deuce, just wondering...
Why are all your signature pictures .gifs?
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Deuce
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Re:Some bad maps!
« Reply #10 on: August 28, 2003, 05:12:18 PM »
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cause i like the way it looks
though i imagine it probably doesnt look as good on a 800x600 resolution..i use 1024..and it has a smudge artistic look.
EdIT - heh..it doesnt look good at 800x600..you poor low resolution people.. i might as well change it to jpg.
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| « Last Edit: August 28, 2003, 05:17:42 PM by Deuce » |
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Primer
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Re:Some bad maps!
« Reply #11 on: August 29, 2003, 09:13:24 AM »
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I'm on 1024 here as well, I just figured you'd be getting a better quality from a jpeg wouldn't you?
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rich-hobo
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Re:Some bad maps!
« Reply #12 on: August 29, 2003, 01:43:51 PM »
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look there are lots of maps that i love, liek torn and backally i can play, i don't like it much, but in reality if people don't like maps, then they don't play them and ususally it's a majority that don't like a map, and like torn used to do it emptied the server, although i loved the map, because people would leave i wouldn't want to play it caus playing dust2 with 20 people is better than torn with 7,
my fav maps, are mostly de_ i like inferno/dust2/nuke/aztec/dust4ever those are my fav maps, but i also like many others
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Holy Grail
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Re:Some bad maps!
« Reply #13 on: August 29, 2003, 02:06:18 PM »
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Yeah, Primer, you would... gif is for less colors... maybe thats why we dont see taht smudge look your talking about lol
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-=]H[=-Smokey
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Re:Some bad maps!
« Reply #14 on: August 29, 2003, 02:07:37 PM »
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Kid, I'm the same way... I usually hate a map because I suck at it alot, and I dont want to play it and I become stuborn... I think thats my problem with some of the maps... I think its your problem too... lol
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Eagle'z Nest 2000-2003 R.I.P
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Re:Some bad maps!
« Reply #15 on: August 29, 2003, 03:45:24 PM »
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my fav maps, are mostly de_ i like inferno/dust2/nuke/aztec/dust4ever those are my fav maps, but i also like many others
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Aww, that sucks. I'm sorry to have to tell you this man, but along with backalley (because you want it removed), we're removing dust2 and aztec from ALL of the rotations because I want those removed.
Any other map that anybody hates will be removed to. Just pipe up people! Instead of getting to nominate which maps you like, you get to pick which ones get axed! Let's see how few maps we get down to! If we manage to eliminate EVERY standard map we'll close the server altogether!
Naw, I'm kidding, but I'm also trying to prove a point. The very same maps that you hate are the maps somebody else loves. Right around 50% of the total map time on CSR is made up of the 10 most popular maps. Only 10! There is another 35% that is made up of ALL the other standard maps (there are 16 of those!). The last 15% is custom maps.
Let's recap:- 10 popular maps get 50% of the play time
- 16 other std. maps get 35% of the play time
- 14 custom maps get 15% of the play time
I think we are already being as accommodating as possible, while still trying to make sure everybody's favorite map makes it into the rotation somewhere.
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[Wumpa] Porter
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Guardian_Tenshi
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Re:Some bad maps!
« Reply #16 on: August 30, 2003, 12:51:40 AM »
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Look, I don't mean to make a stink here, and I know not everyone checks into these boards like they probaby should, but hear me out. Deuce and grounded are like the ONLY people who should be able to whine about which maps are on the server. They the only ones who stepped up to help porter with this HUGE task, and yes, believe me, Porter spent sixteen tons of time with Raven, deuce, and grounded installing, testing, and evaluating which maps are there. After a LONG period of asking for people's opinions, i'd say less than half the community opened their yaps about which maps should and should not make it. Then as soon as the list is final, all I hear is "this map sucks." and "Why isn't this map up?" and frankly, I'm sick of it. Porter tried his best to make the map rotation as lively, fun, and easily playable for everyone as possible. This whole thing started with people complaining about Vertigo, which is now one of the more frequently and highly populated maps on the server. I've seen 10 on 10s in that map. I think as soon as people get used to the map rotation, they'll keep playing. How freaking hard is it to play through one map that you don't like? Challenge yourself and try to practice a certain skill on this map you hate so much. I don't understand, and frankly, I'm getting a bit peeved at the amount of effort being glazed over here.
My vote is you just do what you think best porter, people will adapt.
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Deuce
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Re:Some bad maps!
« Reply #17 on: August 30, 2003, 01:03:54 AM »
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| Deuce and grounded are like the ONLY people who should be able to whine about which maps are on the server. |
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or which maps arent on the server..
*grumble grumble doors too big in losangeles grumble grumble*
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Guardian_Tenshi
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Re:Some bad maps!
« Reply #18 on: August 30, 2003, 01:05:12 AM »
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<<hugs deuce>> just let it go man...it'll be ok. I promise.
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Deuce
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Re:Some bad maps!
« Reply #19 on: August 30, 2003, 01:10:20 AM »
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*secretly plots to change the map to losangeles during a 10 vs 10 game..*
heh heh heh..
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rich-hobo
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Re:Some bad maps!
« Reply #20 on: August 30, 2003, 03:35:56 PM »
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i am glad u all have a sense of humor, there are some maps that i hate, there are maps that everyone hates. I will really play any map unless i absoutely hate it, but i don't like it when i am playing 10v10 in dust2 and then we change to backally or some greenhouse, and then it's 3v4 IF WE ARE LUCKY TO HAVE THAT MANY STAY
and then some admins say well if people start dropping i will put up a vote, but really they will arlready be gone,
THANKS for putting all that time into the server and deciding which maps are in and which maps are out, now i have my own oppions, so does everyone else, i just hate playing in a full server then teh map changing, and then being by myself and having to leave, ya know what i mean
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Grounded
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Re:Some bad maps!
« Reply #21 on: August 30, 2003, 03:55:50 PM »
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"Deuce and grounded are like the ONLY people who should be able to whine about which maps are on the server."
Deuce can complain all he likes but I got all the maps I wanted, and then some
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Re:Some bad maps!
« Reply #22 on: August 31, 2003, 08:10:13 AM »
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| there are maps that everyone hates. |
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Prove it. If you can prove that every single player that uses CSR hates a certain map, I'll take it out personally. Your other choice is to change your statement to something a little more appropriate. I know that I for one don't hate backalley, so right there I know you're lying about "everybody" hating it. That totally discredits any other statements you make, which in turn makes it very unlikely you'll get anybody to take you seriously.
Look, I'm not trying to bust your chops here, but I feel like we're missing each other's points. I understand that you think some maps are not "popular" enough to even be in the rotations at all, but I want you to understand that CSR is not meant to be "popular" okay? (By "popular" I mean only doing what is going to get the most players to join and build the largest community ever.) So get that out of your head right now.
We are not trying to be "just another CS server" alright? The fact that we have such a large variety of maps helps make us unique. I'm just asking that you try to recognize how that is a good thing.
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[Wumpa] Porter
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rich-hobo
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Re:Some bad maps!
« Reply #23 on: August 31, 2003, 04:20:27 PM »
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lol simmer
it's not possible for everyone to hate one map, but when the majorty of people leave because they are like NO NO NO NOT some map, please put up a vote for this map, then the map changes and 75 % of the people leave then, i don't know maby it's me but i would rather play 10v10 on any map then 3v4 on any map.
And there is really no way to PROVE that every player will hate a map. Because as i said everyone is different and has their own oppions thats not possible.
There are some maps that i would like to be taken out, and there are some maps that i would like to be added, and u can't just do that for 1 person, but i would like the admins to just observer and note that when the map changes and 75% of the people leave that it's a sign that maby JUST MABy they didn't like the map to much. Even if the map changes from 10v10 in cs_backally and goes to dust and it's 2v2, then take dust out i don't care what map, i just don't like playing in a full server then having to go somewhere else to play in dif server wehre there are actually people playin
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Deuce
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Re:Some bad maps!
« Reply #24 on: August 31, 2003, 04:32:28 PM »
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| but i would like the admins to just observer and note that when the map changes and 75% of the people leave that it's a sign that maby JUST MABy they didn't like the map to much. |
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i'd say its more like 75% of the people dont have the map and leave because they dont want to download.
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Kaoz
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Re:Some bad maps!
« Reply #25 on: August 31, 2003, 05:46:15 PM »
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okay.... while you guys have a competition to see who's dick is bigger, there are 2 people in the server playing cs_bankrupture. I haven't seen the server this completely empty or lacking of people in months
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Re:Some bad maps!
« Reply #26 on: September 01, 2003, 01:22:59 AM »
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ya know...i so totally disagree with like everything being said here. I've seen the server damn near empty out at like 5:30pm just because everyone goes to get dinner at the same freaking time. Not to mention the fact that people are trying to go to class and all that stuff at this point. The facts are that statistically, the server is going to slow down this time of year because of people doing other things, and I as I pointed out with vertigo, I don't think that it is all due to whether or not people like or dislike the map.
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Yuna
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Re:Some bad maps!
« Reply #27 on: September 01, 2003, 02:16:54 AM »
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If everyone would not be so worried about how freaking well they're doing on a map and take the time to get to know a map that isn't played that often, this wouldn't be an issue. For the most part, I'm guessing, whether you guys admit it or not, you won't play a map that you don't know because *gasp* you might not do well. Heaven forbid someone's stats go down until they learn how to play a map. NO, NO, NO, instead they "hate" the map they don't know how to play. This is rediculous.
Yes, Kidshaft, you do have an opinion, as does everyone and you are aloud to voice it. But when you're saying that either we take the maps out or you won't play, my vote is going to be for you not playing. Everyone here has a "favorite map" and one persons favorite map could be (and probably is) someone else's least favorite map. The point is, we're doing the best we can to accomidate everyone. So deal or play elsewhere. Stop complaining about things that you know won't change and accept the fact that CSR isn't about being the winner of a popularity contest. We're a unique server, with unique players. If you're hooked on playing Dust, Dust2, Aztec, etc. go somewhere else. It's just not that kind of server here.
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Grounded
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Re:Some bad maps!
« Reply #28 on: September 01, 2003, 05:58:04 AM »
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Last night, weary though I was, I noticed the server was on cs_bankrupture with only 2 players so I thought I'd join to try and get things going but I kept getting 'Retrying connection...'. If you see the server only has a few players in then join it! There's no other way to generate interest.
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Darkmage
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Re:Some bad maps!
« Reply #29 on: September 01, 2003, 08:46:13 AM »
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Amen, Yuna!
This game is supposed to be modelled after counterterrorism, right?? Do you guys think the Cts know the inside of the warehouse by heart or where all the Ts probably are? Are the Ts supposed to know where most of the cts are gonna be coming from? of course not.
I personally get a big kick out of playing maps I've never played before.....I also don't really care about stats...coincidence??? probably. . . =P
-DM-
(ps - damn you bankrupture!)
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| « Last Edit: September 01, 2003, 08:51:15 AM by Darkmage » |
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Phoenix Knight
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Re:Some bad maps!
« Reply #30 on: September 01, 2003, 08:56:48 AM »
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Thank goodness! *MASS APPLAUSE UPON DM's POST* Three cheers for DM!
Hip hip!
*Hooray!*
Hip hip!
*Hooray!*
Hip hip!
*Hooray!*
I'd like to saw we should all take a page from DM's book and try the maps we don't know, we might learn someting...like that the map that you think you hate you might actually love! The only way you'll ever find out is to try it, and then you have to remain open-minded about it.
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Nittany
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Re:Some bad maps!
« Reply #31 on: September 01, 2003, 03:09:38 PM »
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40000000000 cheers for kaoz's post.
I think all of you can go read that. I think you missed the point. The maps empty the server and I know some of you think darkmage and yuna addressed the real issue. Well, people don't do well on a map because they don't know it. I'd have to say that nearly everyone knows backalley so 
While people going to eat dinner may empty the server. There is nothing we can really do about that. The only thing that consistently makes people go bye bye are a few maps. While I don't really play at csr because people take an attitude with you if you go 30-3 on a map. It is clear to see that some of the new maps are really cool and are a big hit, but some others are just bad. Maybe just maybe you could swallow some of your pride and reevaluate some of the maps. But then again neither side of this "debate" is showing each other any respect. So.... I doubt that will happen.
PS What is worse? A. Stat whore B. Karma whore
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Kaoz
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Re:Some bad maps!
« Reply #32 on: September 01, 2003, 03:24:43 PM »
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hidden answer C. A Custom Map Whore
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Grounded
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Re:Some bad maps!
« Reply #33 on: September 01, 2003, 04:20:30 PM »
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You know why people (like me and everyone else who isn't complaining about the custom maps) want to get custom maps on CSR? Because very, very few servers play custom maps. If you go to gametiger and put in the name of even one of the most acclaimed custom maps you'll still find barely 5 servers running it if you're lucky and even then most are empty. The difference with CSR is that it is a community server and so we can make an effort to make the custom maps work and get people playing them. The maps have been in the rotation for barely a week and a half and everyone is ready to give up already. Why? I don't know. Most of the maps we've included are vastly superior to anything in the official set. If everyone goes with the mentality 'I don't want to join the server because it's on a custom map and it's only got 3 players in' then NO ONE will ever get a decent game on the custom maps.
Give them a chance, it's not a lot to ask. If you can't hack it and need official maps then join one of the 13 squillion other servers running only dust and aztec.
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Darkmage
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Re:Some bad maps!
« Reply #34 on: September 01, 2003, 04:26:38 PM »
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Hey nittany: Who says there is no respect? I thought these boards were all about respect, sir.
I went back and checked kaoz' post, and if you'll note, I also complained about bankrupture, since I couldnt even find a download location.
Regardless, I urge you to read over porter's post from the beginning of the second page, in which he outlines the percentages of maps played.
The purpose of CSR has never been to be super popular, but rather a community where friends can frag with each other and vote on issues democratically. This is the reason why we don't play iceworld and dust 24/7. I say this with all due respect, as I dont actually know you personally.
/2cents
-DM-
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Nittany
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Re:Some bad maps!
« Reply #35 on: September 01, 2003, 04:46:43 PM »
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Ok, go reread my post. I said maybe someone should reevaluate some maps. Custom or not some maps empty the server. Whether a server is super popular or I don't think it is in the interest of the server to have it emptied. Especially, when regulars are the ones who are leaving.
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Deuce
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Re:Some bad maps!
« Reply #36 on: September 01, 2003, 05:05:10 PM »
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Ok, go reread my post. I said maybe someone should reevaluate some maps. Custom or not some maps empty the server. Whether a server is super popular or I don't think it is in the interest of the server to have it emptied. Especially, when regulars are the ones who are leaving.
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i didnt want to get into this arugment..but i suppose i probably should since in the long end i take credit for it...
right now i'm sorta in between the arguement. i do think people should give the custom maps a chance (which right now i dont think people are doing.) i think it does give variety, and it has giving us some new maps that people actually like (shogun has been a major hit in my opinion). i also think that some of the maps that arent such a hit need to be reevaluated. for instance.. in the long end..i'm sorta glad es_losangeles wasnt put in the rotation..because there would be no one playing it. i guess one thing i didnt factor in while making the rotations was that some people were just going to be stubborn about it (not saying you are kyle..at least you have played some of the maps). i just think before maps can be evaluated again..they need to be played first..and the problem is people arent playing them. once all the maps are finally up..and after some time..i am all for reevaluating them..until then can we just play them and at least try to have fun?
if anything..if we can get out of this 7 or so custom maps that people actually like and that could be part of a rotation.. i would feel like i accomplished something.
there..i think i showed each side some respect.
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Primer
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Re:Some bad maps!
« Reply #37 on: September 01, 2003, 05:49:02 PM »
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PS What is worse? A. Stat whore B. Karma whore
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B.
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Nittany
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Re:Some bad maps!
« Reply #38 on: September 01, 2003, 06:35:08 PM »
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Deuce that is what i'm suggesting. Some maps people will like. Others may look nice and what not, but the gameplay suffers. I think some of the maps again custom or not. Should be reevaluated. And I AM very stubborn over lots of things. I love debating too.
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Grounded
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Re:Some bad maps!
« Reply #39 on: September 02, 2003, 04:32:12 AM »
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I also agree that maps should be re-evaluated however the full spread hasn't even made it into the rotation yet and we're already having this discussion. There is still plenty of 'official map time' on the server so it can't hurt to give the new maps some time.
Darkmage - you can get all the new maps on the downloads page
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rich-hobo
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Re:Some bad maps!
« Reply #40 on: September 02, 2003, 07:56:34 AM »
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Well Yuna i never said i wouldn't play a map caus i didn't know it and my stats would go down. The truth is that i like having good stats, but i am not gona leave when i am doing bad or it changes to some freaky dikey map that i don't know i don't say "dam better leave before my stats go down," i say "this map better not empty the server." And ususally if the map changes and i don't have it i just exit and come to csreloaded.com and download it or go to google and type de_thenameofmap download, and find a site to dl it from
Woot woot for kaoz.
And darkmage, not that i am a SWAT member or anything, but from what i know and have seen on this history channle and The learning channle, the swat and other ct teams around the world have detailed plans of EVERbuilding they go into, even if they haven't been in the building before, they know it better than people that have been in and out of the building a 1000 times before. And besides if u really think that it should be like that then u shouldn't play cs, because u will never see most of those senarios, maby office or something, but dust2? nope thats not realistic.
As i said, the only reason i started this was because i was sick of lookin at csreloaded in my hlsw at 8 pmand see it be on cs_nubcustom map being played and there being 1 or 0 players in there, when if it was inferno or something it would be 10v10.
I will play any god dam map if i have it downloaded, and if i don't i will go download it then rejoin, what i won't do is play a map where it's 1v2 or something caus thats just boring.
ps yuna don't put words in my mouth
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rich-hobo
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Re:Some bad maps!
« Reply #41 on: September 02, 2003, 08:03:47 AM »
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i just realized another thing, we have just so many maps, that even if we had some good custom ones, that it will take months to learn them caus there are so many maps that it's play time in so small
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Phoenix Knight
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Re:Some bad maps!
« Reply #42 on: September 02, 2003, 09:45:45 AM »
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I will play any god dam map if i have it downloaded, and if i don't i will go download it then rejoin, what i won't do is play a map where it's 1v2 or something caus thats just boring.
ps yuna don't put words in my mouth
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First of all, you're just perpetuating the problem if you see a 1v2 and say you don't want to play, cause "it's boring." It's times like that when we need community members to join the server. I'm sure everyone remembers when the server was trying to get off the ground in the beginning and the server was empty A LOT. It took the dedication of the Guardian clan and its members in turn to get this server off the ground. That's what we need from you kid; when you se one or two people on join and wait for more. Sure, sometimes more people won't come, but by you not joining your not helping or providing a solution, your only perpetuating the "problem."
And secondly, I hardly think Yuna put words in your mouth. She stated that as her opinion and a guess, she wasn't cramming those words down your throat.
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Your friendly neighborhood Wumpa~
[Wumpa] Phoenix Knight (aka - Raven Knight)
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Re:Some bad maps!
« Reply #43 on: September 02, 2003, 10:03:16 AM »
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Emptying the server is, as I said before, of no large consequence. It wouldn't matter if the server never had more than 4 people in it at at time! Let me reiterate this very important point: We are not trying to build "the most popular server" here! It just plain doesn't matter if the server empties out. It's gonna happen, you can't avoid it, you can't predict it, you can live with it.
If you personally don't want to play 3v3, that's okay, nobody's making you. But likewise, you shouldn't be trying to make everybody else play 10v10 all the time.
Like I said before, if we were to let everybody vote for the maps they DIDN'T want on the server, we wouldn't have ANY map left. And I'm not about to take out the maps you say should be removed (for whatever reason) and not give everybody else the same opportunity to remove the maps they hate (for whatever reason).
I have not yet heard a convincing argument as to why any particular map should be removed while all the rest should stay. (Let me remind you that "emptying the server" has been discounted as a valid argument. It's simply not an issue for CSR.)
I'm convinced that the way we chose the mapcycles was the most effective way possible at the time. Until somebody can make a reasonable argument otherwise, the "maps that empty the server" stay.
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[Wumpa] Porter
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rich-hobo
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Re:Some bad maps!
« Reply #44 on: September 02, 2003, 11:33:09 AM »
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i have my own opinions on maps, i am saying admins take notice when the maps emptie the server just say, next time this map comes up and that happens, put a vote up or something in the forums asking people what they think about this map, i know you guys most definately won't listen to what maps i would +/- but just pay attention when u are in the server and tehre are tons of people then cs_custom comes up and empties the server 3 times that day, then go to the forums and be like, why won't people play this map, ? don't wana dl, don't like it whatever.
Porter, there is no such thing as "the most popular server", it's not about being popular it's about being community, that satisfy's everyone and if statisfying everyone means having all these custom maps
cs_52sevilla
cs_52villabacho
cs_747
cs_arcticbase
cs_assault2k
cs_bankrupture
cs_boxoffice
cs_crusade
cs_deliverance
cs_docks_v1
cs_futurcom
cs_greenhouse
cs_haste
cs_haste_final
cs_hs_beta2
cs_mice_final
cs_middleage
cs_mm_beta
cs_robbery
cs_shogun_final
cs_thinktank_beta
de_52andalusia
de_52casco
de_52castello
de_52costadelsol
de_52lagranja
de_52leon
de_52mangana
de_52puente
de_52spania
de_aztec2
de_biochem
de_bright
de_chinatown
de_deadlock
de_deep6
de_dust4ever
de_dustbunnies
de_evergreen
de_fang
de_heat
de_italian_v2
de_karachi01
de_lazy
de_legato
de_luxor
de_museum
de_pasta
de_predator
de_Resident_Evil
de_rotterdam
de_suntower
de_survivor
de_village
deuce_beta
es_losangeles
fy_iceworld
fy_iceworld2k
fy_joust
fy_joust_v2
fy_pool_day
playground_x
scoutzknivez
then keep them, but more than half these maps aren't palyed, and the ones that are are played for 2 min, then people leave
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Re:Some bad maps!
« Reply #45 on: September 02, 2003, 11:57:23 AM »
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They can sit there forever and never been played for all I care. ReconGamer doesn't care either. But people can't play them if/when they decide they want to if they aren't on the server.
I therefore fail to see how having all these custom maps available would do anything but help satisfy the community.
And as I've said three times now, causing the server to empty out is not a valid argument here, so stop using it.
Lastly, I'd like to think we'd listen to your map suggestions as much as anybody else's suggestions. We actually gave you (and everybody else) a chance to vote for the custom maps you did want to play, if I recall.
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[Wumpa] Porter
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rich-hobo
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Re:Some bad maps!
« Reply #46 on: September 02, 2003, 02:55:07 PM »
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i know u gave everyone a chance to vote, as for me my computer i was building had a slight problem wiht the motherboard so i didn't have a computer for a month or so, and yes they can sit there thats fine, but votable and on a weekly rotation are different things.
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ayo
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Re:Some bad maps!
« Reply #47 on: September 02, 2003, 03:59:21 PM »
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What i dont understand is why you are saying that emptying the server is not a valid arguement for eliminating the maps. I would think that is the ONLY reason for taking out a map. I dont know about u, but i LOVE to play with a full server. I try to join the server when there is less people in to get more people in, buts its full most of the time....until certain maps come up that totally empty the server to 2 or 3 people.....THIS IS NOT FUN AND NOT BENEFICIAL TO THE COMMUNITY!!! If the community leaves the server due to a map, why should we leave it in??? The community obviously does not like the map or they would leave. I believe that a HUGE majority of the community (the family of csr...csr who lets the community on many if not all of its decisions) would like to play on a full(er) server than an empty one. I think its in the communities interest to be a popular server and to play popular maps that keep people in. I dont recall when csr picked up a "non-popular, empty-welcome server"....we always strived to be a full server. Thats why we uploaded death match type maps...to get people in the server. Thats why we gave people admin access to change the maps to more popular ones (and of course to maintain order in the server). Plus, if we are to be non-popular, then why would we advertise on other sites and such? I dont mean to sound a defiant rebel or be a jerk...but this is how i feel. Know that this is a debate argument and not a flame or anger intended at anyone
ayo
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Father Ribs
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Re:Some bad maps!
« Reply #48 on: September 02, 2003, 08:17:17 PM »
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There were a number of maps CSR tried out that took some time to get popular, but did have a run of popularity nonetheless...I remember when people hated inferno, or Piranesi. How about when we tried out de_isle/isolation, then that became rather popular?
Perhaps the problem is not that there are custom maps, but the ratio needs to be adjusted. I understand that Porter and Deuce and a lot of other people really worked dilligently to set us up with a bunch of custom maps, asked for input, but didn't get it. Unsurprisingly, people are lazy and it takes a lot to motivate them to get off their arses and say something (like "change the rotation"). Feedback is a continual process, not something you do in steps. Some of it is valid, and I'm sure that change will always be a constant on CSR...in all directions, sometimes backward.
Try appreciating what people are trying to accomplish here too, at least they're going through the effort of giving you a unique CS experience. If the sum total of your contribution is negative, why should anyone bother to improve YOUR CSR experience?
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Kaoz
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Re:Some bad maps!
« Reply #49 on: September 02, 2003, 08:27:20 PM »
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god damnit john, why won't you post something useless and unconstructive for once.
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Re:Some bad maps!
« Reply #50 on: September 03, 2003, 02:06:43 AM »
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| What i dont understand is why you are saying that emptying the server is not a valid arguement for eliminating the maps. I would think that is the ONLY reason for taking out a map. I dont know about u, but i LOVE to play with a full server. |
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And I love to play 4v4 sometimes. At other times, 10v10 is more fun. But I would hate it if I never had the choice.
| I try to join the server when there is less people in to get more people in, buts its full most of the time....until certain maps come up that totally empty the server to 2 or 3 people.....THIS IS NOT FUN AND NOT BENEFICIAL TO THE COMMUNITY!!! |
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You should join the server when you want to play. if your goal is to draw more people, that's fine, but I don't think that is CSR's overall goal any more. Regardless, whether a 2 or 3 person game is fun or not is up to those 2 or 3 people, and nobody else. if they aren't having fun, they'll leave. If they are, they'll stay. Nobody else has the right to say whether they shouldn't be allowed to play that way if they want. Furthermore, if those 2 or 3 people have a good enough time playing a small game on CSR to come to the site and join the community, who is to say that isn't beneficial?
| If the community leaves the server due to a map, why should we leave it in??? The community obviously does not like the map or they would leave. |
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Or as Tenshi pointed out, maybe it's dinner time. It would take at least a little statistical research to prove a map wasn't being played because nobody liked it. And as I've said SO MANY TIMES NOW, what about the people who do like it, are we supposed to disregard their opinions in favor of somebody else's?
| I believe that a HUGE majority of the community (the family of csr...csr who lets the community on many if not all of its decisions) would like to play on a full(er) server than an empty one. I think its in the communities interest to be a popular server and to play popular maps that keep people in. |
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So the goal should be to keep random (and regular) people playing the same 10 maps forever instead of doing something unique (that by the way only a very small percentage of the population here has any kind of problem with)?
Let me phrase that another way: in this thread, only 4 or 5 people have said they have a problem with the maps in the daily rotations. Even figuring only 2 or 3 dozen people frequent the forums regularly, that means a very large percentage of people are pleased with the change, which can be determined fairly accurately simply because they haven't complained about anything! In any case, right now the complainers are still the large minority.
| I dont recall when csr picked up a "non-popular, empty-welcome server"....we always strived to be a full server. |
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CSR strived to be an always-full server when it's financial situation was in jeopardy and it needed new members to generate revenue. This is no longer the case since our financial situation is secure, and therefore the argument no longer applies.
| Thats why we uploaded death match type maps...to get people in the server. |
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As I'm sure we've admitted to, this was a mistake that was eventually remedied. While we compromised by allowing these maps to still be votable, their play time has dropped to almost nothing now that the new rotations are in place.
| Thats why we gave people admin access to change the maps to more popular ones (and of course to maintain order in the server). |
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As I understand it, the Admin Team exists solely to police and protect the game server, NOT to act as salespeople trying to get more people to play. Maybe Ribs can expand on that.
| Plus, if we are to be non-popular, then why would we advertise on other sites and such? |
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We are not currently advertising anywhere. The goal isn't to be "unpopular," but it also isn't to be "popular." CSR is here simply to facilitate a game and interaction between the people who want to be a part of it.
| I dont mean to sound a defiant rebel or be a jerk...but this is how i feel. Know that this is a debate argument and not a flame or anger intended at anyone |
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I too want to be clear that I am debating, and not attacking anybody personally. It's just that ayo brought up a number of points that I thought needed clarification.
And as usual, sorry for the long post!
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[Wumpa] Porter
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rich-hobo
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Re:Some bad maps!
« Reply #51 on: September 03, 2003, 07:24:43 AM »
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first off parenise is one of the best maps ever, i have always loved it since it came out with 1.4? or 1.5 can't rember but even though i liked it because people didn't like it and didn't want to play it i would be aginst it to just keep a full server.
And if 2 or 3 people wana play some freak custom map thats fine, but it just excludes the other 6219 players taht have played at out community, now i am not good at math so i might be wrong, but i think that 6219 is a strong majority over 2 or 3 of them.
I COMPLETLY AGREE WITH AYO, if you put the worst map ever ever ever made on csr, but people play and stay and it don't empty when it changes to that map then keep it, but when a map empties the server it's time for that map to go, and if u want i can play cs a lot, and even tell you which maps empty the server I'LL EVEN TAKE SCREENSHOTS TO PROVE
And as i already stated, i thank all the admins for there time, effort and service to the community i know you have done tons of great work, i don't wana sound like you guys aren't doing a good job but you are
It seems that people in this server don't speak up /vote for stuff till it already happens....ex take out statsme in server, 14 people voted and then the decision was acted on, now 14 isn't even a full server but yet only 14 saw it and voted for it. Then again this is a whole new issue, and i have class i need to get to, so i will finish the second half of this when i get back
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Porter
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Re:Some bad maps!
« Reply #52 on: September 03, 2003, 09:53:53 AM »
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| And if 2 or 3 people wana play some freak custom map thats fine, but it just excludes the other 6219 players taht have played at out community, now i am not good at math so i might be wrong, but i think that 6219 is a strong majority over 2 or 3 of them. |
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You are assuming that all 6219 people are sitting in front of their computer watching HLSW waiting for the map to change, which I think is probably a gross exaggeration. You are also assuming that even out of the people who ARE on HLSW (or likewise) and trying to decide whether to play right now or not are concerned only about which map it's on, and not other factors like who is playing, what map is next, how much time they have to play, and how much they need a CS fix.
| I COMPLETLY AGREE WITH AYO, if you put the worst map ever ever ever made on csr, but people play and stay and it don't empty when it changes to that map then keep it, but when a map empties the server it's time for that map to go, and if u want i can play cs a lot, and even tell you which maps empty the server I'LL EVEN TAKE SCREENSHOTS TO PROVE |
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As I've said so many time nows, we're back to the same point: I refuse to sacrifice the opinions f some for the opinions of others. You want a map taken out, and other people want the map to stay. Who do I listen to? Who's point is more valid? Why are you any more entitled to get your way than anybody else?
At least with the rotation the way it is now, nobody can complain about us NOT having their map. Everybody can be happy at least a little, which is better than only some people being happy all the time.
| And as i already stated, i thank all the admins for there time, effort and service to the community i know you have done tons of great work, i don't wana sound like you guys aren't doing a good job but you are |
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Thanks. I/we appreciate it. I know that's gotta sound sarcastic in the middle of all this, but I mean it.
It seems that people in this server don't speak up /vote for stuff till it already happens....ex take out statsme in server, 14 people voted and then the decision was acted on, now 14 isn't even a full server but yet only 14 saw it and voted for it. Then again this is a whole new issue, and i have class i need to get to, so i will finish the second half of this when i get back
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Has your mom ever asked you if you needed anything from the store? Have you just shrugged at her because you were busy with something else, but were mad later when you went to have breakfast and saw that you were out of your favorite cereal?
My point: You were all asked for your own personal input. If you shrug at us, we get to decide what to do on our own. If you really don't care, then shrug away, but you better think hard about whether that's really what you want, because coming back complaining after the fact is not going to earn you many points.
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[Wumpa] Porter
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Nittany
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Re:Some bad maps!
« Reply #53 on: September 03, 2003, 11:57:13 AM »
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A. You get a cookie for figuring it out! I wouldn't call 6000 an exaggeration, I would call it an hyperbole. If you don't know what that is then ask and i'll define it.
B. Yes, people when going into public server consider what map is on. I consider amount of people, the map, and if my friends are in their as the deciding factors if i'm going to join that server.
C. Stop making the issues out to be what they aren't. This ISN'T an issue of I don't like this map so take it off. This isn't an issue of well some people like to play with less then two people in the server This IS an issue of some maps consistently causing people to in mass exodus leave the server. And nobody is so stupid as to buy into oh it could be dinner when it happens at 10pm. Then someone might say they are going to sleep and your excuses will be endless when it is plain and simple to see certain maps empty the server. I guess if you want proof kidshaft can make a new thread everytime this happens. That should make it clear enought to you. Here is a better idea. I'm sure there is logged data on how many connects come at certain maps and times. It should show very clear there.
D. I feel that I'm just wasting my time. Because the response that any of us get from our posts is regergitated hypocriticol crap. And while nobody from the other side of this debate has really touched any of my posts. I mean porter did say that nobody playing in the csr server isn't a problem. Like when the problem with the fy maps came up. Where did they go because the same people that are defending the custom maps defended the fy maps. Using the basis of it brings people into the server, and well people want to play them so who is to say that part of our community can't enjoy the map?
Well, you know what screw it. I really don't care enough to keep writing when I rarely play here anymore and people dodge my questions. Congrats porter, you took over the server. Have fun.
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Re:Some bad maps!
« Reply #54 on: September 03, 2003, 03:00:34 PM »
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D. I feel that I'm just wasting my time. Because the response that any of us get from our posts is regergitated hypocriticol crap. And while nobody from the other side of this debate has really touched any of my posts. I mean porter did say that nobody playing in the csr server isn't a problem. Like when the problem with the fy maps came up. Where did they go because the same people that are defending the custom maps defended the fy maps. Using the basis of it brings people into the server, and well people want to play them so who is to say that part of our community can't enjoy the map?
Well, you know what screw it. I really don't care enough to keep writing when I rarely play here anymore and people dodge my questions. Congrats porter, you took over the server. Have fun.
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Now who's exaggerating?
There's no need for people to get huffy and self-righteous about this. Thus far most messages in this thread have been written calmly and rationally, like any good discussion.
Let me see if I can lay it out:
We (i.e. me, Porter, Deuce and everyone else who wanted/helped on the custom maps) added custom maps to the server with a view to adding some variety, to the general approval on the forums. Now that the maps are in circulation, people are complaining that they empty the server. Fair enough. BUT, would it be so difficult to give them a chance just for a while longer? It's frustrating having spent time and effort helping out on this to see people willing to give up so quickly. I'm sure in the near future the vast majority of these maps will be binned and only a scant few kept but can't we pretend, just for a bit, that having these maps in the rotation is a worthwhile exercise?
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rich-hobo
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Re:Some bad maps!
« Reply #55 on: September 03, 2003, 07:34:44 PM »
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the problem is that if people won't play them now, why will they say hey, i guess in 3 weeks i will try it, they either have tried it or never will there is not middle it's black and white no gray here and i have thanked you guys for your effort and time on the maps, i just feel that well if maps empty the server take them off rotation not oh it was 2 am, and everyone left when the map changed to dust, i wouln't say take dust off, unless it happened a lot, i didn't start this part saying omg they all left on this one map, it was day after day this map or this map just emptied the server, thats why i started it.
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Deuce
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Re:Some bad maps!
« Reply #56 on: September 03, 2003, 07:37:25 PM »
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people are taking this too seriously..
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Yuna
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Re:Some bad maps!
« Reply #57 on: September 03, 2003, 08:41:15 PM »
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I agree Deuce. And as I try to ignore the personal remarks made about me, I'm still seeing little point to this. CSR is what it is. It's not going to change. We are a server of a different breed. Unique to say the least. All of us, obviously, have very strong opinions that aren't going to be budged easily.
All I can say is, thanks to all who have shared their opinions (negative or otherwise) and I'm sorry some of you feel so strongly that we aren't up to par. CSR will not conform. We stand by what we are and will not budge. Don't like the maps and the way things are run, then leave. Plain and simple, it's a solution. I don't want to see good people go, but quit fighting over what's not going to change.
Nittany, I'm sorry you feel that we are so ignorant to your ways of wisdom. It's always been fun playing with you and you've been one of the best sports when it comes to evening teams and what not. Sorry that you feel we are a waste of your time, but if that's the position you feel you need to stand by, kudos to you.
I'm done for now, unless someone comes up with something "valid" to say.
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f.k.a. [Wumpa] Wannabe, [Guardian] Yuna
n.k.a. [Wumpa] Yuna
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Nittany
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Re:Some bad maps!
« Reply #58 on: September 03, 2003, 09:21:56 PM »
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That wasn't a fair well post. I haven't been playing on the server much at all due to various reasons. Main reason probably being school. I try to get out and do things with people as much as possible here. Also, I have to do lots of work. Even though I still have a considerable amount of time to play cs. I usually spend that time helping out my roommate in the servers he plays in. There is other things as well.
I'm just not going to argue, debate, or question anything here anymore. No matter how much I disagree with what is done, said, or if it is plainly false. I really care about the server and I've been active on it for as long as i've been playing cs. Which is approaching two years. I will still come in and play with with all the people I usually joined the server to play with.
See ya around
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www.mofothis.com
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Deuce
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Re:Some bad maps!
« Reply #59 on: September 03, 2003, 09:29:35 PM »
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| I try to get out and do things with people as much as possible here. |
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you should invite me over sometime 
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Yuna
[Wumpa]
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Re:Some bad maps!
« Reply #60 on: September 04, 2003, 12:01:38 AM »
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I wasn't assuming you were leaving, I just wanted you to know that I think you are valued here and I hate to see anyone feel the way you do.
That's all! Glad to hear your stickin' around though!!
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f.k.a. [Wumpa] Wannabe, [Guardian] Yuna
n.k.a. [Wumpa] Yuna
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Guardian_Tenshi
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Re:Some bad maps!
« Reply #61 on: September 04, 2003, 10:33:58 AM »
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For the record, I'd just like to state an observation I had yesterday with one of my favorite maps, and I think it will help people better understand a few points. Last night we were playing a regular stock CS map (i don't remember which one). As the map got near done, we had nearly attracted enough people to fill the server (this is what KidShaft wants right?).
Next map was de_747, in case you didn't know, this is the map that I nominated on the server. It is in my opinion an awesome map. No sniper garbage, real CT style CQB action, a chance to use SMGs, and let them shine! Of course, that's just my opinion.
Point is, there were only three of us in that map. I'd say it was easily 8 on 8. KidShaft, the point is, you want to take maps like de_747 out of rotation.
Realize that an easy five people were downloading the map, and only about one of them finished the download (the others either timed out or got frustrated and left). And that this is my favorite map ever. So, Porter's point is that to please you, he'd have to essentially piss off me, by saying sorry Tenshi, your map sucks, and no one wants to play it. So he is in a catch-22 either way he looks at it.
Question now is...do people drop because they haven't downloaded de_747? Do they really hate de_747 enough to drop from the server when it pops up next in the rotation? or are they just not giving the map a chance? Questions that I don't think we can answer, BUT hopefully, as more and more strong regulars show up on the "odd-ball" maps, the server will become the pillar of strength that it always has been.
Anyway, hope that helps everyone see each other's point of view. And please don't throw de_747 out of rotation just because some people don't like it. I swear it is an awesome map with lots of fun areas that look decievingly simple.
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Nittany
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Re:Some bad maps!
« Reply #62 on: September 04, 2003, 03:22:28 PM »
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Deuce I guess you could visit my dorm sometime. There really isn't much to see though or do in my dorm. I go to other peoples dorms. If I'm going to go to anyone elses dorm. PJ is coming over now though. We'll see how that goes.
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Grounded
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Re:Some bad maps!
« Reply #63 on: September 04, 2003, 03:25:47 PM »
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Good post Tenshi. I agree that we should give the maps some time - and eventually cut back to the ones people are willing to play.
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rich-hobo
Guest
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Re:Some bad maps!
« Reply #64 on: September 04, 2003, 05:52:24 PM »
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yes i was playing and it was pretty full then the map changed, and if u rember i left, and was back in prob 2 min, i left caus i didn't have the map, i went to google, typed "de_747 download" found the first site, when to ti downloaded it, put it in cstrike/maps and was back in before second round was over it was much faster than downloading from server, plus it didn't lagg the server like it seems to do constantly no matter if someone is dowloading or not, and i was back, i always tell people to do this google thing, but they just sit and wait for 20 min to dl the map from server, if u do that no offense to anyone u are a IDIOT it takes so long and is stupid. and i particarlll don't like cs_747 or de_747 but as people asked us regulars to join in and play when the server is empty so i did just that, played a map i din't like and it was 2 on 1 it was pretty boring but i stayed hoping maby a few more would join and it would get to 3v3 or 4v3 or something, but it was still 2v1 and i just said to my self it's not worth playing when i am not having fun, caus i have a 2970 page brit-lit book to get started on
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Nittany
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Re:Some bad maps!
« Reply #65 on: September 05, 2003, 11:43:29 AM »
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Just as a suggestion Jake. Use paragraphs.
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-|TWB|- aZuS (CSR-P)
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Re:Some bad maps!
« Reply #66 on: September 05, 2003, 12:34:29 PM »
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Why should he? He is a college man now! 
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i like kittens
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Deuce
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Re:Some bad maps!
« Reply #67 on: September 05, 2003, 12:36:55 PM »
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forget paragraphs...
| yes i was playing and it was pretty full then the map changed, and if u rember i left, and was back in prob 2 min, i left caus i didn't have the map, i went to google, typed "de_747 download" found the first site, when to ti downloaded it, put it in cstrike/maps and was back in before second round was over it was much faster than downloading from server, plus it didn't lagg the server like it seems to do constantly no matter if someone is dowloading or not, and i was back, i always tell people to do this google thing, but they just sit and wait for 20 min to dl the map from server, if u do that no offense to anyone u are a IDIOT it takes so long and is stupid. |
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he made that into 1 sentence!!
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rich-hobo
Guest
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Re:Some bad maps!
« Reply #68 on: September 05, 2003, 02:54:59 PM »
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it's not a god dam paper for class, it's a god dam cs server forums, it doens't matter
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Porter
[Wumpa]
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Re:Some bad maps!
« Reply #69 on: September 05, 2003, 04:37:56 PM »
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it's not a god dam paper for class, it's a god dam cs server forums, it doens't matter
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I think it matters, at least a little. I mean, I would honestly take you more seriously if you made the effort to type like an adult instead of a 10 year old chatroom brat.  I mean no offense by it, but it really is so hard to read and understand sometimes that you might as well have leaned your elbow on the keyboard and hit 'Post'. It makes me assume you've put about as much thought into your argument as you have into your grammar. 
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[Wumpa] Porter
--Silent, professional, lethal... sometimes.
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Deuce
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Re:Some bad maps!
« Reply #70 on: September 05, 2003, 04:41:27 PM »
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i dont know about you guys..but this is really getting fun to read
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Yuna
[Wumpa]
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Re:Some bad maps!
« Reply #71 on: September 05, 2003, 05:54:43 PM »
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| I mean no offense by it, but it really is so hard to read and understand sometimes that you might as well have leaned your elbow on the keyboard and hit 'Post'. |
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LOL
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f.k.a. [Wumpa] Wannabe, [Guardian] Yuna
n.k.a. [Wumpa] Yuna
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Kaoz
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Re:Some bad maps!
« Reply #72 on: September 05, 2003, 06:10:45 PM »
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Paragraphs really make things easier to read, if it's not in paragraph format i skip the post
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Deuce
CSR Super Ultra Mega Nerd
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Re:Some bad maps!
« Reply #73 on: September 05, 2003, 06:13:33 PM »
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Paragraphs really make things easier to read, if it's not in paragraph format i skip the post
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i can stand one long paragraph..its the punctuation, or lack of punctuation that can throw me off.
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| « Last Edit: September 05, 2003, 06:15:16 PM by Deuce » |
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Kaoz
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Re:Some bad maps!
« Reply #74 on: September 05, 2003, 06:16:23 PM »
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they tend to go hand in hand
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LeTHaL DoSe
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Re:Some bad maps!
« Reply #75 on: September 05, 2003, 09:12:19 PM »
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i usually skip posts that are more than 3 lines...
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aka Mister Triggers
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Father Ribs
Admin Team, -TWB-
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Re:Some bad maps!
« Reply #76 on: September 06, 2003, 09:38:59 AM »
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Writing is one of the skills that sets an intelligent person from an ape wearing trousers. You're going to be writing a hell of a lot in college, and if you're not cleaning toilets later in life, you'll probably be doing a bit of writing after college too...so every chance you get to practice should be taken. You know...practice makes perfect.
I guess one of the few advantages to the internet (besides learning new sexual positions) is that many people are practicing and enhancing their writing skills. Then again, some people are so low down the writing evolutionary ladder that it's a step up to not write in ALL CAPS.
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SR: R. I. P. 2001
CSR: R. I. P. 1/22/2003
CSR-P: GGZ
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Darkmage
[Wumpa]
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Re:Some bad maps!
« Reply #77 on: September 06, 2003, 01:14:15 PM »
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Ribs, I wish you were my dad.
You could kick the crap outta all the other dads in CS and probably the other kids too. =D
-DM-
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| « Last Edit: September 06, 2003, 02:29:54 PM by Darkmage » |
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One day we must all take a step and stop dreaming
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Kaoz
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Re:Some bad maps!
« Reply #78 on: September 06, 2003, 01:33:41 PM »
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So where laroche is ignorant and lazy, i am elitist and high and mighty.
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ayo
Guest
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Re:Some bad maps!
« Reply #79 on: September 06, 2003, 09:10:15 PM »
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Since i dont know how to post quotes from posts and then write after it and then put another quote (like porter did to my previous post), i wil lhave to paraphrase or remind what someone said then comment on it.
Porter said that only a few, a minority of players are arguing about the empting maps. My argument (if we are still arguing this) is that only a few and a minority are arguing in favor of it as well!!!! It works both ways!! There are a ton of people not complaing, that is a fact. But we dont know if they are not complaing b/c they like the maps and dont want them gone, or if they are just too lazy to post. Or many server regulars dont even freequent the forums and some dont even have names!
Nittnay also brought up a good point. He said that many people like the fy maps and why should we deny people who like those maps from being in the daily rotation. Now personally i hate this maps with a passion, but its still a great point and would be a complete contradiction of "why should we deny people their favorite maps" point.
Thirdly, i would still like to ask where and when we adopted this "csr doesnt want to be popular, but not unpopular, but doesnt mind map emptying maps" policy. I dont know when we picked this up and i havent seen anyone that has agreed or stated this policy before this incident.
I do agree with grounded tho and i think we should give these maps some time to get played and downloaded. who knows maybe it is just b/c they dont have it downloaded. But i think if after a while (and hardly no one in the server is d/ling the map) and a certain map (custom or not) empties the server, i think we should reevaluate it. Do u think this is a fair compromise??
ayo
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Deuce
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Re:Some bad maps!
« Reply #80 on: September 06, 2003, 10:03:04 PM »
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| I do agree with grounded tho and i think we should give these maps some time to get played and downloaded. who knows maybe it is just b/c they dont have it downloaded. But i think if after a while (and hardly no one in the server is d/ling the map) and a certain map (custom or not) empties the server, i think we should reevaluate it. Do u think this is a fair compromise?? |
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i'm already working on a solution that should satisfy everyone's demands (i already showed kidshaft a rough version of the new layout i'm working on..and he says its better..so take that for what its worth). it focuses more on the "popular" standard maps, while still keeping a few new ones in.
its also going to have the same criteria of each standard map appearing at least once during the week (i saw a 8 v 8 havana game, and saw office clear the server on the same day..so i really dont see much about the "clears the server" argument working for the standard maps - - EdIT : backalley just lasted with a solid 8 v 8 game - -)
i might post more about it later when i finalize it. right now i have more important things to do (like reading 100 pages about crap i already know about for college)
but it cant be put into effect until the rest of the maps are up and people actually try playing them.
| Since i dont know how to post quotes from posts and then write after it and then put another quote (like porter did to my previous post), i wil lhave to paraphrase or remind what someone said then comment on it. |
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copy and paste the text you want to quote (the most recent posts are under where you type you own post), then highlight it, and click on the Insert Quote icon
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| « Last Edit: September 06, 2003, 10:41:23 PM by Deuce » |
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Porter
[Wumpa]
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Re:Some bad maps!
« Reply #81 on: September 07, 2003, 10:01:25 AM »
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| Porter said that only a few, a minority of players are arguing about the empting maps. My argument (if we are still arguing this) is that only a few and a minority are arguing in favor of it as well!!!! It works both ways!! There are a ton of people not complaing, that is a fact. But we dont know if they are not complaing b/c they like the maps and dont want them gone, or if they are just too lazy to post. Or many server regulars dont even freequent the forums and some dont even have names! |
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Right you are ayo! There are tons of people NOT complaining. So unless they have a big enough problem with something to pipe up, you have to assume that changes are just fine with them. If they really didn't like something, they would post (or register in the forums and THEN post, if that's what it took) just like you are.
| Nittnay also brought up a good point. He said that many people like the fy maps and why should we deny people who like those maps from being in the daily rotation. Now personally i hate this maps with a passion, but its still a great point and would be a complete contradiction of "why should we deny people their favorite maps" point. |
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fy maps aren't in the rotations because they directly conflict with the goals and values of CSR. I thought that was pretty clear. We compromised on this one by leaving them on the server and allowing them to still be votable. (Let me tell you, if I had my way and it was MY server, those maps would have been deleted so fast your head would spin.)
| Thirdly, i would still like to ask where and when we adopted this "csr doesnt want to be popular, but not unpopular, but doesnt mind map emptying maps" policy. I dont know when we picked this up and i havent seen anyone that has agreed or stated this policy before this incident. |
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I said it in my last post. It's not an official policy though-- I was merely pointing out what I thought was a very obvious fact. Running CSR is not cheap. When Maximus ran CSR, he was paying for it, but he didn't want to be. That's why he was always trying to find ways to get players to donate money. The tourney, the memberships-- all of that was so that Maximus wouldn't have to pay for CSR out of his own pocket. The goal was to get as many people to come to CSR as possible so there was a greater chance of getting donations and memberships. We ALWAYS had to have more people bringing money to CSR so we could "stay afloat." I hope everybody understands all this so far.
The CSR you are looking at now is paid for in full by one person who wants to be paying for it. He doesn't mind paying for all of it on his own as long as it gives him a great place to play CS. That means we don't have to do things to get money. And THAT means we don't have to do things to get as many new people to come to CSR as possible. And then THAT means we're not striving to be "popular" anymore. Does that still make sense?
I do agree with grounded tho and i think we should give these maps some time to get played and downloaded. who knows maybe it is just b/c they dont have it downloaded. But i think if after a while (and hardly no one in the server is d/ling the map) and a certain map (custom or not) empties the server, i think we should reevaluate it. Do u think this is a fair compromise??
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Yes, that's entirely fair. Deuce is already working on some changes along those lines.
copy and paste the text you want to quote (the most recent posts are under where you type you own post), then highlight it, and click on the Insert Quote icon
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The easier way is to just click the "Quote" button on the top-right side of the post you want to quote. It will take you to the "Reply" form that has already been filled in with that person's post.
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[Wumpa] Porter
--Silent, professional, lethal... sometimes.
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