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Topic: cs_reloaded_b3 feedback (Read 386 times)
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Deuce
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cs_reloaded_b3 feedback
« on: February 29, 2004, 08:32:13 PM »
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Please leave all b3 feedback here 
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Re:cs_reloaded_b3 feedback
« Reply #2 on: February 29, 2004, 09:42:39 PM »
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Is b3 "polished" enough to add to the rotations? I'd like the three authors' input more than anything, but it would be nice to hear from the players on whether they think it's ready too.
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[Wumpa] Porter
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Deuce
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Re:cs_reloaded_b3 feedback
« Reply #3 on: February 29, 2004, 09:44:54 PM »
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if its going in the rotation, i would have to ask that people would be able to download it off the server. people arent going to know where to go to download it.
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Deuce
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Re:cs_reloaded_b3 feedback
« Reply #4 on: February 29, 2004, 09:48:58 PM »
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and on a side note..when cs_reloaded is finally done.. there should be a day where the only map that is running is that. give people plenty of time to download it.
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TheeKiller
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Re:cs_reloaded_b3 feedback
« Reply #5 on: February 29, 2004, 10:31:51 PM »
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Too Dark  Or it could be my monitor....
Otherwise its pretty good, job well done. 
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slightcrazed
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Re:cs_reloaded_b3 feedback
« Reply #6 on: March 01, 2004, 08:59:22 AM »
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I did find it a bit dark as well, but my monitor is crap.... I have to hand it to grounded for getting the map done in time...good job. Even though you did forget my Hummer.
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Terraji
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Re:cs_reloaded_b3 feedback
« Reply #7 on: March 01, 2004, 10:06:17 AM »
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Although I didn't get to play it in the admin challenge, I did get to play it for a bit earlier yesterday afternoon in a 2v2/3v3 game.
I was quite impressed in how much amazingly better the map looked. It is apparent alot of care and effort was made to get it to look snazzy and it does. Great job guys!
Also, the extra passage into the parking garage, I think, gave the map a bit of extra flow on that side of the map which it needed.
Since I didnt play in the big game yesterday, I may be a bit out to lunch here, but I am still concerned with the way the CTs start out with the hostages. It seems that the hostages are still rescued a bit too often as a resolution to a round.
When the spawns were switched in b2 I wasn't as opposed to it as some people were. It did make for an encouragement to camp on the part of the terrorists, swinging the balance the other way, but I think it is the start of the key to a more balanced map with a more traditional (and proven) dynamic to it. Of course, the T camping problem would have to be resolved.
I am looking forward to playing it alot more in the next few days.
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Grounded
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Re:cs_reloaded_b3 feedback
« Reply #8 on: March 01, 2004, 10:31:54 AM »
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I don't think we had an overwhelming number of rescue wins last night, although there was a bias towards CT in the final score. I think that stems more from inexperience with the map than anything else - with this layout the Ts need to really work together to lock down both the main routes and, for the first few rounds at least, it was a bit more of a free-for-all. Later on we started to get some good variation in wins/strategies.
I think we should try and organise more playtests soon. Instead of picking a time and urging people to pitch up I think we should operate the same confirmation system as the admin game to make sure we get good numbers. As was pointed out last night, the map seems to work better with big teams.
I don't think it should go into the rotations before final but if I'm outvoted on this point I don't mind.
PS slight - you left the keys in the hummer and the WC gremlins nicked it.
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Deuce
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Re:cs_reloaded_b3 feedback
« Reply #9 on: March 01, 2004, 10:35:26 AM »
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PS slight - you left the keys in the hummer and the WC gremlins nicked it.
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i told you that would happen.
we cant be that far off from a final cs_reloaded anyway right? theres only a few more texturing jobs to do..then we have to tweak r_speed performace?
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Re:cs_reloaded_b3 feedback
« Reply #10 on: March 01, 2004, 10:38:09 AM »
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Maybe the T spawn could be moved to an area near the breakroom? this would give the T's a choice rush to camp the rescue point or rush towards CT spawn? Or I guess just stay put and wait for the CT's to come by? Maybe the breakroom area isn't the right spot but you get the idea.
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Re:cs_reloaded_b3 feedback
« Reply #11 on: March 01, 2004, 10:39:26 AM »
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The only change to the current layout that we need is to fix CT spawn up properly. I'm going to make it so you can get back up to the roof or go down to the hossies much more easily. Of course I'll need a few days off mapping to recuperate after the weekend  In the meantime you boys can pick up the slack and get the rest of the replacement textures done It's almost all cosmetic/performance issues from now on in.
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Deuce
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Re:cs_reloaded_b3 feedback
« Reply #12 on: March 01, 2004, 10:40:26 AM »
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grounded, if you make a complete list of what textures we need, i will have them ALL done in 3 days. maybe 2 if i'm not busy.
thats dedication baby
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Deuce
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Re:cs_reloaded_b3 feedback
« Reply #13 on: March 01, 2004, 10:53:24 AM »
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oh. and while we're on the subject of textures.. can we combine all the wad's into one wad? i like have 10 different wads loaded up in quark.. i wanna get rid of them all
also, could you upload the latest .map too?
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Re:cs_reloaded_b3 feedback
« Reply #14 on: March 01, 2004, 12:34:12 PM »
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The map wasn't too dark for me.
That one liscence plate is backwards.
You should do the inside of Ribs' office with some hidden stuff.
When a terrorist activates "no bagel, no bagel, no bagel" all counter-terrorists within hearing range should be slain.
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zeus
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Re:cs_reloaded_b3 feedback
« Reply #15 on: March 01, 2004, 12:46:52 PM »
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I looked at the map and I have to say you guys did a good job cant wait to see the finished product
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Grounded
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Re:cs_reloaded_b3 feedback
« Reply #16 on: March 01, 2004, 12:49:50 PM »
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grounded, if you make a complete list of what textures we need, i will have them ALL done in 3 days. maybe 2 if i'm not busy.
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There is a fairly complete summary of missing textures here:
http://www.csreloaded.com/yabbse/index.php?board=21;action=display;threadid=688;start=1035
The wads are not all combined together because of problems I was having with WC. I added a new texture to the main wad and WC wouldn't function from then on. When I added the texture to one of the smaller wads there was no problem. Since you're using Quark it might not be a problem - I'll get round to uploading a full wad in the next day or so.
Miscreant - as Deuce has already pointed out to me (repeatedly!) there are lots of backwards tex: easy to fix There is also an office for Ribs waiting to be included I just didn't have time to add it this version. I'll keep the 'answerphone-slaying' idea in mind
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Re:cs_reloaded_b3 feedback
« Reply #17 on: March 01, 2004, 12:59:41 PM »
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I just thought of something. I don't remember exactly the "no bagel" context in the show but I don't think it was telephone related. Maybe I'm wrong. But, Kramer did have his movie phone thing which was definitely phone related. So that is an idea for what then phone could say instead.
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Re:cs_reloaded_b3 feedback
« Reply #18 on: March 01, 2004, 01:12:02 PM »
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| Since I didnt play in the big game yesterday, I may be a bit out to lunch here, but I am still concerned with the way the CTs start out with the hostages. It seems that the hostages are still rescued a bit too often as a resolution to a round. |
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I think it encourages objective-based game play that way. So many times, (even during the Admin game last night!) I saw CTs on office simply running around trying to kill terrorists. office has the best chance out of ANY of the cs_ maps for rescuing the hostages, and it's a TONS easier way to win than having to actually fight the other team. Anything that encourages that should be put on a pedestal as an example to everyone.
I think cs_reloaded falls into that category.
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[Wumpa] Porter
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Fotty
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Re:cs_reloaded_b3 feedback
« Reply #19 on: March 01, 2004, 01:16:58 PM »
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one advantage at least 1 CT will get is the 300 dollar bonus they get for grabbing the hosties at the rounds start... while it may not matter so much later, it does allow for additional money in the pistol round which is supposed to be an even 800 for everyone... guess there is nothing you can do about that though....
maybe something illustrating the rescue point a little more would be better... i know where it is.. but if i didn't it would be hard to find..
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slightcrazed
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Re:cs_reloaded_b3 feedback
« Reply #20 on: March 01, 2004, 01:19:11 PM »
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That's why I came up with the idea initially, I got sick of playing rescue maps where no one tried to rescue the hostages. And the amount of times that the hostages were actually rescued is extremely low in a traditional map, maybe once in 20 rounds. So I came up with the idea of putting the CT's with the hostages. The idea being that the CT's are airdropped into the middle of the hostage situation, and have to lead the hostages THROUGH the terrorists to get them out. It's the same idea as a VIP map, only instead of the VIP being a player, it's 2 hostages.
slight
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Skip
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Re:cs_reloaded_b3 feedback
« Reply #21 on: March 01, 2004, 01:20:55 PM »
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is the door to Porters office going to be fixed?
If you jump on top of it and then get behind it you're stuck until someone comes to kill you.
I just thought of this.
Most doors in your average office complex are glass or have windows in them so that people coming in opposite directions don't collide. Would it make sense to put windows in some of the doors? So you could look thru and see someone coming, but not someone crouching or hiding off to the side. This may be to difficult to do though....
Also maybe you could have one of the backs of the storage reloaded delivery trucks open? Maybe one is and I don't know it, I don't recall checking.
Security camera's at the reception desk would go nicely on top of the one side of the desk where I believe there's nothing currently? working or non-working?
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Re:cs_reloaded_b3 feedback
« Reply #22 on: March 01, 2004, 01:23:13 PM »
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Most doors in your average office complex are glass or have windows in them so that people coming in opposite directions don't collide. Would it make sense to put windows in some of the doors? So you could look thru and see someone coming, but not someone crouching or hiding off to the side. This may be to difficult to do though....
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I think there are visibility issues. Half-Life compiles its maps based on "rooms". You have to completely restrict visibility between them to keep the map running fast. I'm sure these three gurus have a more accurate explanation. 
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[Wumpa] Porter
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slightcrazed
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Re:cs_reloaded_b3 feedback
« Reply #23 on: March 01, 2004, 02:04:18 PM »
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Porter is half-right, and half-wrong. It doesn't matter what you can see, only what the game engine *thinks you can see. Any entity (which includes all moving doors) are considered non-blocking (i.e. the engine thinks you can see through them) which means that adding glass will not impact engine visability beyond what it already is.
It is actually really easy to do, and as I'm a BIG fan of glass (see the skylight in the lobby) I might lobby (play on words) Grounded to add glass to some of the doors in the future.
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Guardian_Tenshi
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Re:cs_reloaded_b3 feedback
« Reply #24 on: March 01, 2004, 02:50:48 PM »
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I meant to post something here...umm...the map was dark, but i kinda liked that, it made things challenging, but didn't distract from game play.
I mentioned to slight about the "Tenshi" computer not blowing up...I was originally hoping it could blow up, kind of like I did it in this picture... 
Not sure whatever happened with that...It's not a huge deal, but would be cool...
I'm a bit concerned of the ct bottle necks near the exit to the garage, and the steps leading up to the Terror spawn, and the final step out of the office, but maybe it's better off that they ARE like that...I guess that's up to the developers.
Tenshi
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Re:cs_reloaded_b3 feedback
« Reply #25 on: March 01, 2004, 05:27:47 PM »
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I just thought of something. I don't remember exactly the "no bagel" context in the show but I don't think it was telephone related. Maybe I'm wrong. But, Kramer did have his movie phone thing which was definitely phone related. So that is an idea for what then phone could say instead.
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I forgot about that! But what would I do with my precious 'no bagel' wav file then?
"is the door to Porters office going to be fixed?"
In a word: yes.
"maybe something illustrating the rescue point a little more would be better..."
We were planning on making a custom decal for just that purpose but didn't have time to get it in for b3.
"Also maybe you could have one of the backs of the storage reloaded delivery trucks open?"
This has been a favourite suggestion for a while. Trouble is, that area is already pushing it polygon wise so it can't really accommodate any more details unless we find some other details to remove. It might be possible to have an open van somewhere else in the map though.
"I'm a bit concerned of the ct bottle necks near the exit to the garage, and the steps leading up to the Terror spawn, and the final step out of the office"
I don't know - do we need bottlenecks or not?
"I mentioned to slight about the "Tenshi" computer not blowing up..."
I'd forgotten about this. The Tenshi computer will officially be blowing up in the next edition
"Security camera's at the reception desk would go nicely on top of the one side"
Security cameras will be making an appearance too.
And finally: glass doors. Glass doors are great - except when they are rotating glass doors. In HL there is a fundamental problem in that you cannot tie an object to two different entities; in other words you can't have a ladder that rotates or a swinging door that explodes. So to have a see through pane of glass in an opaque rotating door you need to make the glass itself a seperate rotating door that swings in tandem with the other door. That in itself is not a problem but if you stand in a position that will block the edge of the door but not block the glass then the glass will swing on past you and leave the door behind. It's kind of hard to describe unless you see it happen in game but suffice to say there is no way round it. I can still put rotating doors with glass in the map, we'd just have to be content with the fact that the error would always be there.
Here ends my doctoral thesis on rotating doors with glass. Class dismissed.
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biggums
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Re:cs_reloaded_b3 feedback
« Reply #26 on: March 01, 2004, 11:41:30 PM »
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Props to everyone who made it. The map in general i like, it's kinda big for my taste but full server it's duable, still haven't learned the whole map (mostly the inside), oh porters office is crap, get some more stuff in it, The projector room that has cs csr and csreloaded stockthingy, the projector isn't there, neither the 2 back trucks are only the cargo area and not the cab. All in all good map, it's dark, but the sky is dark it's a night map, so the darkness i like, a street lamp or 2 here and there shoudl be ok.
One problem is that ct's always have advantage of getting hosties and then buying armor in beginign
As for the map to be on for one whole day, stupid idea, most regulars know www.csreloaded.com and can download it there, then just put 1 of those red letter thingys that says download all custom maps and other maps at www.csreloaded.com
Mad props to the makers
WOOT WOOT
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| « Last Edit: March 01, 2004, 11:43:11 PM by biggums » |
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Re:cs_reloaded_b3 feedback
« Reply #27 on: March 02, 2004, 04:31:28 AM »
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| neither the 2 back trucks are only the cargo area and not the cab. |
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You mean you couldn't see part of the white Storage Reloaded vans?
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Re:cs_reloaded_b3 feedback
« Reply #28 on: March 02, 2004, 08:19:04 AM »
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That happened to me too Grounded, when I was reviewing the HLTV demos. Just the rear ends showed up, and the cabs were entirely missing. The projector in the conference room DID show up for me though.
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Re:cs_reloaded_b3 feedback
« Reply #29 on: March 02, 2004, 08:25:03 AM »
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where are the demos of the sundays game?
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Re:cs_reloaded_b3 feedback
« Reply #30 on: March 02, 2004, 08:36:33 AM »
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Deuce and I are working on deciding which ones are worth posting, and weeding out the worthless ones. These things are whoppers too, so we need to be kind of selective (so as to not piss RG off). The biggest one is 40 minutes long (or about that) and is about 45 MB uncompressed.
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Re:cs_reloaded_b3 feedback
« Reply #31 on: March 02, 2004, 09:45:56 AM »
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Both the van cabs and the projector are func_walls so maybe that has something to do with it - in the next version I'll make them world brushes, then there shouldn't be a problem. The van cabs need redone anyway - they're too complicated in their current form.
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Re:cs_reloaded_b3 feedback
« Reply #32 on: March 07, 2004, 08:26:06 AM »
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I just had my first chance to play this map this morning on my own...
I'm very impressed with the new look compared to b2. It looks a lot more complete, the night-time look of the map is brilliant - really really like it
I was just thinking when I saw Porter's car and office how cool that was, especially with accompanying Mac and picture frame.. oh I mean monitor...
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Re:cs_reloaded_b3 feedback
« Reply #33 on: March 08, 2004, 05:36:57 AM »
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I'm sure you'll get a chance to play a game on it soon enough. Another playtest anyone?
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Druz
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Re:cs_reloaded_b3 feedback
« Reply #34 on: June 18, 2004, 01:49:20 AM »
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I don't know which beta I've played but whatever it was, was really cool. The map is pretty well done but I have a few things to say about it.
For one.. the terrorists need some kind of indication as to where the CT's drop their hostages off, after a few plays you learn where but you should be able to know from the first time you play this map.
There are alot of cool goodies around the map and exploring it is pretty cool in itself, but as a terrorist most of the time I found it dissapointing that I couldnt explore the map. I spawned where the CTs had to go and the most efficiant way to defend it is from the same exact spot. Sure.. I could go one of 3 days the CTs could come but thats a big gamble and I find that staying at spawn is the best way to win.
Now, you could say that I shouldn't look for the best way to win I should just enjoy the map but it is simply easier. There is no incentive for a terrorist to go one way or another because the ct's could just have gone another way and you find yourself racing back to your spawn anyway.
I dont know what I am suggesting but I hope what I said helps in some way
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Re:cs_reloaded_b3 feedback
« Reply #35 on: June 18, 2004, 04:00:21 AM »
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Thanks for posting Druz - it was probably cs_reloaded_b4 you played but there isn't a feedback thread for it. Yeah most of the points you made have come up before - there is actually a rescue point decal on the floor at T spawn but it's red and hard to see against the asphalt. With small numbers of players, Ts usually do have to stay at spawn to win (or use the video cameras to see which way CTs are coming) but once you have enough players to cover the different routes, maybe 4+, you can push out from spawn to meet the CTs. I suppose the gameplay is kind of like assault in that sense. There might be some significant gameplay/layout tweaks in the next edition, if I ever get started on it!
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Re:cs_reloaded_b3 feedback
« Reply #36 on: June 18, 2004, 07:37:05 AM »
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I think the other thing to remember is that the layout isn't all that different than oilrig. cs_reloaded doesn't play like a normal "cs_" map such as italy or militia. On those maps, it's okay for the Ts to advance, because if the CTs slip past and grab the hosties, the Ts can fall back to the CT spawn and prevent the rescue.
On oilrig and reloaded, the CTs start with the person/people they are trying to rescue, and the Ts start where they are trying to get to. On oilrig, the Ts really never have a reason to go down below, since all they have to do is camp the roof and the chopper to win, but they tend to advance downward anyway. That tendency is part of what helps keep the map balanced (since Ts getting stuck deep in the rig is frequently an advantage to the CTs, and the only thing allowing the VIP to escape half the time).
I think the same kind of principle is at work in cs_reloaded. If it weren't for the fact that Ts will tend to advance down one or more of the 3 paths, I don't think the CTs would stand much of a chance.
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[Wumpa] Porter
--Silent, professional, lethal... sometimes.
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Grounded
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Re:cs_reloaded_b3 feedback
« Reply #37 on: June 18, 2004, 03:01:01 PM »
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Yeah oilrig is a better comparison than assault. One thing that did come out of the Bootcamp playtest was that rounds tend to last a long time if the hossies get killed. Not sure what to do about that yet...
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PanchoDaz
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Re:cs_reloaded_b3 feedback
« Reply #38 on: June 18, 2004, 03:02:54 PM »
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i wanna play!!!
you on tomorrow stu?
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